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Federal regulators are threatening to crack down on for-profit schools that are eager to take students' cash, but aren't necessarily coming through with lucrative paying gigs upon graduation. Those for-profit schools include a number of culinary schools around the country that are increasingly taking the heat. Several are embroiled in actual lawsuits.
According to Politico, the Department of Education is expected to set what many call "gainful employment" rules as early as this month. That move could severely limit the ability of for-profit schools to access federally-backed student loans. That means cooking schools like Le Cordon Bleu, Art Institute of Houston, Western Culinary Institute and dozens more, might be facing their own elimination challenge as they face increasing pressure to prove their students are able to secure jobs upon graduation, and have the ability to pay back student loans that can quickly reach $50,000.
Attorney Michael Louis Kelly, who is suing Career Education Corp. (the parent company of Le Cordon Bleu) on behalf of California students, told NPR that the school made unrealistic promises.
"The model doesn't work," Kelly told NPR. "You can't got to school, accumulate $30-, $40- or $50,000 in debt and then go into an industry where you're going to have to start out at $8 or $12 an hour."
"Top Chef" contestant Tiffany Derry threw her whisk into the fight. In an essay for The Hill, she argues that the proposed changes will adversely affect minority and low-income students.
"The proposed regulation is going to hurt students who need help the most: students who are considered at-risk, minority and low-income or older students who may be raising a family by themselves. The rule erroneously points to debt-to-income ratios and repayment rates as measure to determine whether or not students who attend a program are eligible to receive financial assistance," she writes.
The "Top Chef" star also happens to be a graduate of the for-profit Art Institute of Houston, and returned to teach there, according to the Dallas Observer.
Campus Progress writer Kay Steiger challenges Derry's position and says that an important part of the argument is the loan pay-back rate.
"According to the Department of Education, the Art Institute of Houston's federal loan repayment rate is 37 percent -- not enough to instantly disqualify it from receiving federal student aid, but low enough to put the school in the 'restricted' category if its debt-to-income ratio is also bad," writes Steiger.
What do you think? Has tuition at culinary schools reached a boiling point? Share your thoughts in our comments section.
Read about the nation's first full-time high school culinary program at The Huffington Post.
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3-17-2011 @9:37PM Che fDex said... I am in total agreement with many of those who have commented. I too graduated from culinary school many years ago and am still paying back my loans. When I graduated it took about 3 months to get a job and I started out making $7/hr. Many students to will face much larger tuitions than I did (around $ 25,000) and since most jobs start at around $8-9/hr they are going to find themselves in a financial hole very quickly. Something has to be done, to ensure that once a student graduates they will have a support network through the school that will assist them in obtaining a job prior to graduation.
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3-17-2011 @9:30PM Linn said... My son graduated with his bachelors from the Culinary Institute of America (u cannot get a masters) 2 yrs ago & has struggled with making $13.50/hr at one the best rated restaurants in NYC....
he is extremely depressed because he feels he was conned...he loved the school but he definitely is NOT seeing the jobs & $ that was promised that would happen by going to such a prestigious world renown school. I feel terrible because I pushed him to continue there to get his bachelor's!!
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3-17-2011 @11:34PM CHEFDUBOIS said... I graduated from the CIA almost 30 years ago. I am sorry to say, things have changed. When it was only 1 campus, they could be more selective as far as student admissions and staff were concerned. They have expanded too much. I wont discourage kids to go there, but it is not for me. I have not been back there in 30 years . What we had back then were Chefs who knew it all. With the econamy as bad as it is, people tend to cut back on things such as dining out. How many restaurants and caterers have closed? Hotels and resorts are having a bad time
3-18-2011 @7:38AM Brown said... I totally agree, that these schools are a rip off. I have a daughter who attends the ART Institute for culinary. Not my choice because what they offer is extremely over priced. But this is her passion so I support her. However the loans are mounting up and so are my parent plus loans. I do think the government should get involved by thoroughly investigating what these schools are actually claiming they offer. If this is found to be untrue, then they should be responsible for paying back some of the students debt. It's ridiculous and I pray my daughters reads this and a light comes on for her. She's a great cook and was before entering this school and all she needs to do is get started in the field and learn from others and attend a credible school for her BA degree. I was considering letting her finish her BA degree at this school but after reading this article, I will not spend any more money on a BA here. Some Attorney's need to step up and challenge all of these Culinary Schools. I'm sure once precidence is set in California where it always seem to start, things will begin to dwindle down. I wouldn't recommend any students wasting their money or their parents money on these schools
3-17-2011 @9:54PM culinary grad said... Culinary school is not worth it, both my husband and I went and we have jobs in the field but we didnt need this degree to obtain these jobs. It is not worth the price....... trust me!!!!!
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3-17-2011 @10:00PM Dan M said... I have to agree with what has been said in these comments. Although when an individual does commits to higher education no matter what it is, upon graduation it is up to that person to take their ambition, motivation and what they have learned, and go make something of themselves. I do agree that there are way too many culinary schools out there that are pumping out graduates (not chefs) that the communities can’t absorb, especially in the present economy. I have been in the industry for over 20 years, for one year I taught at a school in Texas as a pastry instructor. The school bought the rights to use the name Le Cordon Blue as a selling point ONLY. This particular school eventually offered a separate pastry program to individuals that wanted to specialize in pastry. I took the job only because I couldn’t find a job in the field. This didn’t make any sense to me. Here I was teaching bunch students about pastry and to my knowledge there wasn’t a whole hell of a lot of jobs out there. Then there is the good part. i can remember some of the instructor meetings we would have with our department heads. We were told to pass everyone regardless of how bad they may be because if we didn’t, the students wouldn’t get their loans and the instructors and other employees would not see a paycheck. I left soon after that. So think about that, it’s kind of like one big allusion for these kids are buying into.
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3-17-2011 @10:47PM Gina said... I know a young woman who graduated from this school in the socal area. I'm not familiar with their curriculum, but this poor girl wouldn't know the difference between a gateau and ganache.
She did get a diploma, and bakes cookies, cakes, etc for family and friend's parties. They are quite decorative, but can't decorating classes be taken at a community college?
3-17-2011 @10:17PM Allison said... I've been a chef for 32 years. I never went to culinary school. I learned on the job. I've had culinary graduates come to me for jobs and I refuse to hire them. I will hire someone with no exprience or culinary education and train them on the job IF they show the determination and backbone to hang in there and do what's necessary to get ahead.
My niece ignored my advice and went to a Le Cordon backed school. She's now in hock for $35 grand and 2 years out she's just now making $13.25/hr. Her loan payback is $395 a month for the next 15 years.
Culinary schools are a waste of time and money. It's best to find a solid company and a good experience chef to have mentor you. A culinary degree is no guarantee of a job. Do not buy into the bull the schools sell about high incomes on graduation and guaranteed job placement. Neither happen. If you insist on going to college, get a non-culinary degree (I have 2 bachelors, one in business and the other in marketing).
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3-17-2011 @10:28PM Loislane said... I am new to this industry. I graduated college in 96 with a bachelor's in Political Science and History, and never worked in my field. I managed to forge a career in Marketing Sponsorship instead, after many unforefilling year's in this industry, I found what gave me the most peace was cooking. I went about investigating the cost to attend the culinary schools here in NYC, after looking at the fee's I took some VERY sound advise and got a job as a dishwasher. Although, it was VERY hard and laboring intensive work I loved it.
I still was leary about attending any culinary school, as I had already finished paying off my undergrad student loans. I decided what was best for me was to take certain classes that were considered "The Foundation Basics"..I.E. " How to make sauces, knife skills" and I build my skill set from there. Unlike most who replied my goal was not to work for someone but to work for myself. I began by interning in various kitchen's again to improve on my skill set..
Although, my experience and goals are different from those who have responded I have to agree that the cost of Culinary Schools are EXPENSIVE, most of those who exist these schools will not be featured on " Top Chef, Man vs. Food" or any of the other culinary programs that are aired, who give the impression that this profession is easy to enter.
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3-17-2011 @11:17PM RONALD CAPPUCCIO said... When government gets involved, it always causes a problem. The student loans should be dischargeable in bankruptcy. Then, when the graduates cannot pay back the loans, the banks will stop lending money to the disreputable schools. By protecting the banks, only the schools and financial institutions profit and can exaggerate their charges.
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3-18-2011 @3:18AM Steve said... I do agree with you on the principle of not having the government start regulating this, but something has to change with higher education. It is a scam that is perpetuated in all of our Universities too. If the government starts giving out these "forgiveable" loans that disappear after 10 years, then it will just get worse too.
Bankruptcy or lawsuits that define culpability would put the pressure on institutions to make students be job ready.
Better yet, have the Colleges only get compensated fully after gainful employment in their career is found. Base it on starting wages. They will quickly learn to put out students that are prepared and excited about thier careers. You will see more engineers for sure!!!
3-17-2011 @11:23PM ESCOFFIER DUBOIS said... The problem with Culinary Programs (colleges and these welll advertised schools) is that they paint the Culonary in such an unrealistic way. It is one of the hardest professions people will ever get inot. The hours are insane as is the work and pressure. Many people have no idea what they are getting into. There are so many restaurants and so many Chefs positions, real ones not like a Chef at a greasy spoonThe students today come out of school with unreal expectations. Just because you graduated school does not make you a Chef. Being a Chef means working long hours, missing holidays with you families and learning all you can. Working at 5 places in 2 years means nothing. You have to reallly love food and have a passion for it. In our business, there are plenty of shoemakers( a person from Mc Donalds who thinks they are a cook). If people get into the Culinary business because of all these food shows and celebrities like Top Chef, Chopped, Iron Chef and Rachel ray, please stay home and boil eggs Those networks and shows are just like the land of Oz, definetly not real world. I was trained with Old school chefs like Uwe Hestner and Gerhardt Koenicke. Those people were Chefs. The Chefs today know nothing compared to their predicessors. The mystery basket/ingredient type of show, only copies something the American Culinary Federation has been using for over 30 years
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3-18-2011 @1:03AM Gina said... Rachel Ray is most annoying when she uses the words chicken broth and chicken stock interchangeably. I'd love to see her version of a demi glace.
3-18-2011 @12:05AM Mom of culinary student said... My son is currently at Le Cordon Bleu. The "counselors" are smooth-talking salespeople who tell the kids that "everything" is included. Then they find out they need other supplies. It's like a cattle drive. They run three shifts of students each day through those kitchens. $50,000 is a ridiculous amount for what they get and the jobs they will be able to get when they are done. My son is currently doing his required externship and, although he is at a trendy restaurant, it is $12 per hour and no one ever gets full-time hours so NO benefits. How do you ever repay the ridiculous loans they talked the kids into?
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3-18-2011 @11:47PM fritanga said... I taught at a culinary school for 3 years. Many students were like your son, talked into the expensive courses with promises of future "chef jobs." Many other students, however, were the children of wealthy parents who were at their wit's end over the directionlessness of their kids and to whom the idea of any job for them was worth the expense. Other students were well-off "career-switching" adults, many bored by being housewives or highly paid professionals (all of whom had the wherewithal to start their own restaurants upon graduation). Culinary school is great if you have the money and can go to the major ones (CIA, Cornell, Johnson and Wales), but it's not advisable if you have to take out huge loans for a culinary education which will not pay off in kind.
3-18-2011 @12:59AM John Donut said... While I have no doubt that the story is factual, I can only speak from my own experience.
At my culinary school orientation, (Le Cordon Bleu) the chefs were very clear about success in the industry. We were told more than once that the odds were against us. We were told that less than 25% of us would graduate, and of those that did, 75% would not be in the industry in 5 years.
It was made clear that you were likely not going to get rich cooking, or baking, and if it was not your passion, your true desire, do not continue to the first day of class.
The same facts were again given to us upon the completion of our first class, at which time we lost 18% of our classmates.
Not exactly the money grubbing diploma mill that most describe. That being said, be sure of what you want, those figures are real, and the majority of my classmates are not in the industry, most didn't even make it to graduation.
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3-18-2011 @1:44AM Barbara said... It is not only the culinary schools I saw it in the surgical technician program that I taught in.. here in tucson.. theschool people give the students high hopes for great pay and guess what they come away with a huge bill and work for 12.00 a hour. and not many hospitals want to take on a student ..that has just graduated. I was so dissapointed in the tactics these people use, I quite teaching. Its not fun when they are promised the world and have to face the fact they are not going to make the great wages they were told.
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3-18-2011 @1:47AM barbara said... I agree these schools need to be regulated they are doing it here in AZ at the HIgh tech insit. and Brown mackie college... promise them the world the smooth talkers and then start piling on more expenses and more school it really suck for these kids...
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3-22-2011 @12:42AM jackie said... yes. i graduated from san francisco city college culinary school and found a job. 8 bucks an hour. 15 years ago. would have been more, now.
but how much more?
if you want to cook for a living, all i can say is you better love it. it might or might not pay your bills (probably not).
apparently they promise you that you will be the next Star.
not gonna happen, baby.
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3-18-2011 @3:17AM Steve said... Running multiple restaurants and interviewing 1000's of people over the last 10+ years, it breaks my heart to see so many young kids in debt for years, with no way to reasonably pay back school loans. The Culinary schools are not necessary or affordable for a majority of the students. In fact I often avoid these candidates because I know they will be discontent as the real world facts set in for them.
BTW this is true with our elite universities too. It is amazing how many employees I have that have their bachelors and masters degrees. They are stuck with 10's of thousands of dollars worth of loans for degrees that they don't even have any idea of what type of job they could apply for to utilize it!!!!! Whether it is loans or grants, this is fruad. These schools took money with the intention of educating these very young adults to be able to compete for jobs, but never told them that there is extremely few jobs applicable to them.
Engineering degrees however are worth every dollar. Philosophy degrees..... Admirable and might be helping the student be a better citizen, but that is a lot of time and money for a self enlightment journey.
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