It's World Vegetarian Day!

10-01-2007 @3:27PM Big John said... Lentils are popular with vegans for protein. Unfortunately it falls just short in provided all nine proteins the body can not make on its own. Soy milk is another popular source and can be found 'enriched' with extra proteins. Personally, I'd rather have rice milk but there isn't much to it.

I lived with vegetarians/vegans for a while and I'm a bit glad I'm not under their thumb anymore. Most seemed to be in it more for the 'fad' aspect than anything else. Some of the meals would be pretty good but others were obviously "toss a bunch of veggies together and call it a soup after we dump it through a food processor".

This is not to say I have anything against veggie dishes. One of the guys was a very talented cook, self-taught as far as I knew. He made some great soups (ones that tasted more than onion and black pepper) as well as some jaw-dropping sweet potato burritos.
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10-01-2007 @3:42PM Dirk said... There are different kinds of vegetarians. None, if we go by the literal definition of the word, eat fish (it is an animal, yup). Ovo-lacto vegetarians eat eggs and dairy products, with varying degrees of awareness over whether or not a cheese was made with rennet. Some are just one or the other - ovo (eggs, no dairy), or lacto (dairy, no eggs). Vegans eschew all animal products, so no eggs, dairy, or (for most of them) honey.

I've been ovo-lacto for a little over 16 years - not so much a fad, but yeah, I know the type. The same can be said of any cultural phenomena, however, and not just vegetarianism. And, I might also add that given the vast number of choices in the vegetable and fruit world, I'd wager my diet is much more varied than if I declined to consider something a meal unless it had at its center fowl, beef, or fish.

At any rate, I get scads of protein - from beans, nuts, soy products including tofu, TVP, tempeh . . . , seitan (made from wheat), and pretty much any other food stuff. Let's just say I'm not exactly wasting away and have easily maintained a higher level of fitness than when I did eat animals. The whole "complete" protein dscussion is basically true - soy may be an exception, but most non-animal foods do not contain a complete protein with all nine amino acids. So if I ate nothing but black beans I'd probably be in trouble, but with a varied diet I get more than enough. And the notion that you have to combine vegetarian protein sources within a single meal or day was a misguided recommendation, and turned out to be a myth.

Shelterpaw - your first link goes to a retail golf site, not Wikipedia.

Hope nothing I've said here comes off as combative - not my goal at all. Just relaying a little information, it being World Vegetarian Day and all. :)
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10-01-2007 @3:48PM shelterpaw said... Sorry about that first link... My bad.

The proper link is here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vegetarian
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10-01-2007 @4:04PM Adriane said... Dirk-
Not combative at all! It was a great commentary/view into veggie life. I really have to give props to someone who can stick with vegetarianism (or vegan, whoa!) for more than a decade! I'm sure now to you it seems commonplace-- was it difficult in the beginning to determine what you needed to stay healthy? I know was to many "vegetarians" who eschew animals yet barely eat any veggies and end up eating prepackaged ICK..seems to partially defeat the purpose, in my mind.

Interesting, I never realized Vegans refrained from honey, too. I mean, aren't they technically insects? And is this about exploiting animals/insects solely or something else? I ask because I wonder in daily life outside of the food realm how they conduct themselves-- do they think nothing of swatting a fly or killing a spider?--or are a vast number of vegans more "buddist" about the whole thing and refrain from killing ANY bug/animal. My curiousity is running away with me!
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10-01-2007 @4:14PM Garrett said... Oh my, the ignorance. Sigh.

I've been a vegan (no dairy, eggs, meat, or fish) for around 5 years, and vegetarian (no meat or fish) for 3 years before that. Nutritionally, several studies have shown that you don't need to get all nine amino acids at once, your body can make the ones you don't get. As far as the amount of protein, it is recommended that you get between 15 and 30% of your calories from protein... That is actually not that much surprisingly and many vegetables like broccoli or kale contain more than 15% of their calories from protein.

The one thing people commonly bring up next is that one can't get b vitamins from vegetables. The fact of the matter is that vegans get the disease, pernicious anemia, statistically as often as non-vegans. Plus, the cow you eat gets its b vitamins from bacteria, which a vegan can get from pro-biotic sources such as nutritional yeast, soy yogurt, certain pickles and sauerkraut, kombucha, etc.

Add to this the simple fact that in countless studies vegans live longer than vegetarians live longer than meat eaters (although those that ate meat once a week or less faired as well as the vegans).

So, basically what it comes down to is if you are a healthy omnivore, you could become an even healthier vegan, but if you eat junk food now, you'll probably end up being a junk food vegan.

Hope this clarifies things for people, for the record, I'm vegan mostly for health reasons.
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10-01-2007 @4:17PM Garrett said... (possible) reasons why people are vegan:

- smash capitalism
- support local farmers
- boycott factory farming
- believe it is ethically wrong to support the killing of animals
- health
- the environment (it takes vastly more fossil fuels and food to produce beef, chicken, fish, etc. in industrial settings)

I'm sure there are others...
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10-01-2007 @6:06PM AK said... Please note that of the twenty amino acids that make up proteins, nine are termed "essential," which means that the body CANNOT synthesize them and they must be taken in by the diet. There seems to be some confusion as to this subject, particularly among certain individuals who are decrying the "ignorance" in the comments. Take a course in biochemistry. Also, it's "fared," not "faired."

While I'm not a vegetarian or a vegan, I think that it's a perfectly fine choice as long as one does not feel compelled to harangue those who are not vegetarians about the immorality and sickness of their diets, as many vegetarians and vegans I've run into feel the right to. I don't try to get you to eat meat, so don't pester me to eat seitan or tofu instead of chicken.

I would apologize for the tone of my comment, but it's quite annoying for people to trumpet their imagined superiority, especially when it comes to food choices.
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10-01-2007 @6:32PM Jon said... Adriane - Insects are most definitely animals. :)
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10-02-2007 @9:47AM Jon said... Garrett, being a vegan doesn't necessarily help you smash capitalism, support local farms, or boycott factory farming. Unless you're getting your tofu from a small local soybean farm, that is. It's possible to be anti-capitalist and support local non-factory farms while still eating meat.
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10-02-2007 @10:30AM mo said... Unfortunately, "vegetarian" is one of those terms that people have decided to create their own definitions around. Therefor, some "vegetarians" eat fish (after all, they aren't cute and furry). Personally, I think a "vegetarian" who eats chicken should be slapped (metaphorically) because that is taking things too far. They, like me sometimes, can call themselves "semi-vegetarian" to get across the idea that they eat very little meat.
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10-02-2007 @10:41AM sonia said... I find it funny that the vegan is apologetic for his tone even though he does not come across as being combative, yet the omni, who does, feels no remorse. AK, it's equally annoying to have people holding dead animal flesh in your face when you've chosen not to eat it (which I've been subject to as a vegetarian). I could go on and on with the crap I've had to deal with (metaphorically, of course) over the past 14 years for being a vegetarian.

Thanks for demonstrating that a judgmental jerk is a jerk, vegetarian or not.


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10-02-2007 @11:47AM shelterpaw said... Such lovely comments. All I wanted was to find some of the best sources of protein on a vegetarian diet. I'm not a vegetarian, but would really like to eat more vegies and get protein in my diet at the same time.

From poking around on the web I've read that Soy protein and Hemp seed protein seem to be the most complete sources? As soy upsets my stomach, does anyone have other sources?


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10-03-2007 @8:50AM Adriane said... Oh my, the ARROGANCE. sigh.
Heaven forbid people don't know everything about every diet out there *rolls eyes*

Ps- Sonia, I think you have it backward. The ovo-lacto Veggie was not combative yet apologetic, the combative vegan was not. Maybe it's because he's constantly having to defend where he's are coming from? Either way, sounds like Garret's got a stick up his bum. (haha)
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10-02-2007 @3:06PM Jonathan said... From the wikipedia article on "complete protein" (yea i know... wikipedia isn't necessarily a valid source (except maybe on the internet itself), but i have heard this from other sources as well):
"Some plant and microbial sources also contain complete proteins, including spirulina, quinoa[2], soy, buckwheat, hempseed, and amaranth, among others."

Quinoa is great because it has as much protein as wheat, but has none of the allergy issues or gluten issues as wheat. Millet also has about the same amount of protein and is also easily digested.
Soy which has been fermented, such as in tempeh is more easily digested because of enzymes created during fermentation, so may be more suitable for some people with soy sensitivities.
Legumes are a good way to get your protein because they are hearty. Nuts, too are high in protein, but are also a good source of "good fat"; unsaturated fats which promote "good" cholesterol (HDL) and fight the "bad" cholesterol (LDL).

But if one just eats a balanced diet you will get plenty of protein, as pretty much all food has some protein in it.

I've been vegan for 6 years now (0 years vegetarian before that) and have never had any health issues because of it. i just eat what i want, and luckily i crave a healthy diet.

I just hiked the long trail in Vermont (272 mile hike from the southern to northern borders of VT), and stayed vegan the whole trip (about 26 days), and never once felt like i wasn't eating right or that i was lacking anything, other than fresh fruits and veggies, which are too low in calories to warrant carrying considering their weight. Though it may be anecdotal but this is just an example of how eating vegan is not as limiting as most people think it is; no more so than most people's diets.
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10-03-2007 @9:06AM Adriane said... Jonathan-

Way to go on hiking the AT! Ever considered thru-hiking?
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10-03-2007 @1:29PM Jonathan said... Adriane- Thanks! Actually, I did thru-hike it, I guess I wasn't very clear on that. And it was the Long Trail not the Appalachian Trail... well, actually, they run together for the first 3rd of the LT then the AT splits off to head toward NH and ME. I was thinking of maybe section hiking the AT; I don't think i would enjoy hiking it all at once.

The trail was sooo pretty and rewarding and the weather was really good for most of the trip, thankfully. I am happy i had the privilage of being able to do it.

PS Long Trail also happens to be one of my favorite breweries, and appearently they used to provide beer on the trail on top of Killington sometimes, or so I heard from a local, but that was years ago.
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10-03-2007 @6:59PM AK said... Sonia - regarding me being a "judgmental jerk" - you're welcome. I would argue (judge?) though that when someone starts a post accusing everyone else of being ignorant (as well as adding a dramatic, typed sigh), the first impression is not understanding and empathy with other views.

If people are literally shoving meat in YOUR face, then I understand your frustration and I sympathize (as I alluded to in the second portion of my post). However, if you are simply disgusted by watching others eat meat, regardless of whether they offer you any, then I don't. It puzzles me when vegetarians eat meat substitutes, but I don't get in their faces for choosing to do so. So please grant others the same courtesy.
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10-03-2007 @7:07PM AK said... Shelterpaw - lentils and beans are great ways of getting more protein. There are also many different varieties which can give you a great amount of diversity in your diet. Most people think of lentils and beans as just being in soups, but you can grind up lentils (after soaking them) and cook them to make pseudo-breads like dhokla and chile (an Indian griddle "bread" made with ground-up mung beans). You can also take gram flour, combine it with water to a loose-paste consistency, mix in salt, tumeric, tomatoes, onions, and cilantro, and eat it straight like that. It tastes very good (in my opinion anyway).

If you're not lactose intolerant, you can try paneer, which is Indian cottage cheese. The curdling agent is usually lemon juice so it is completely vegetarian. Paneer is also very versatile and recipes are readily available online.

Best of luck with your dietary changes.
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10-04-2007 @11:02AM Adriane said... Jonathan-
Ohhh, for some reason I was thinking most of the long trail was within the AT. At any rate, a gorgeous hike. Have you done the Franconia Ridge in NH? I haven't yet but I would really like to- it looks so goregous. That'd be sweet if they handed out long trail at Killington! Never heard that before, though. hm. Ever had Harpoon? They're located in Windsor (and Boston)-- their facility is great and worth checking out for 'local' beer.

AK- I LOVE PANEER. Haven't had it in aaages. Although not exactly healthy, breaded with some spicy concotion and fried is delicious. Mmm.
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